But Nathan, you have common sense. This whole thing is not about common sense; it is about flooding the country with more "takers."

Frank .... I challenge you to prove to us all that illegal immigrants are not being shown how to or finding ways to vote. Ever since the motor voter law was passed allowing anyone to simply mail in their voter registration without any personal interaction with a BOE trained human being or requiring them to provide proof of citizenship and the legal right to vote in the registration process there is no guarantee that 1 or 1,000,000 illegal immigrants have not voted in past elections or will not be able to vote in upcoming elections.

However, this whole argument over the adjective used to define their immigration status is moot as soon as they are found to be ILLEGAL! If we are going to redefine ILLEGAL for one purpose then I guess we should redefine it for any purpose that suits our needs or political and social agendas. The next time you are caught speeding just tell the judge you were not illegally driving over the posted speed limit, you were merely adjusting your speed to better suit your needs. The next time a bank robber is caught they should just tell the judge they were not illegally committing bank robbery they were merely making an unauthorized cash withdrawal to better spread the wealth for social justice.

I don't really know why I bother to respond to your mindless remarks on here anymore because you will certainly respond with one of your ridiculous fallacies and rude insults as demonstrated above.

The first three people who stayed in the US after their Visas expired who I had any connections to (through people I knew) were a beautiful blond Polish girl, a Scottsman, and a Mexican migrant farm worker who fell in love and had a baby he didn't want to leave. Two of the three don't look much different from my mother, who never had a birth certificate. Like many poor people, she was born at home in Delaware. Fortunately for her, after she for married, my father taught her to drive and took her to get a state issued license. I suppose you could have called her "undocumented." Fortunately, at that time, it was so common, the MD MVA accepted her Baptismal Certificate as proof of citizenship and age. She has had a driver's license ever since. But what of the others, who never learned to drive. There are many legitimate US citizens who are "undocumented." I also disagree with "illegal" as basic human rights would dictate that no one's existence is illegal. There are many people who've been her since before they can remember but whose presence is not authorized by the US government. Since many of these people entered with legitimate visas, many did not enter the country illegally, but it is their continued presence that violates our laws. Therefore, I believe we should use "unauthorized immigrant."

Frank ... I never claimed an illegal immigrant was voting under my father's name but since you seem to want to bring him into the conversation all the time now please give me your address so I can come prove a negative to you personally.

So much politically correct b.s.

Bill--If people call someone an "illegal" there might be some point to your second paragraph. Otherwise, the term "illegal immigrant" uses illegal as an adjective, not a noun. The person is an "immigrant." Whatever adjective one uses (undocumented, unlawful, illegal, etc.) doesn't change that. As an adjective, it's not the same as calling someone any of those other words you used.

Commentous - while this topic may be about the term "illegal immigrant" and "undocumented", that doesn't mean in the real word "Illegal" or "Illegals" isn't used as a pejorative noun. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=illegals

Commentous - I realize you acknowledge the case, I'm just pointing out that it isn't an if people call someone an "illegal" but rather *when* people call someone an "illegal".

Should we just call them future democrat-voters?

"Should we just call them future democrat-voters?"

That, obviously, is up to the Republican party. There are plenty of Rs who are pro-immigration reform (including Condi in her speech last night and Jeb (not to mention the rest of the Bush's) as well). Then again, there are plenty of Rs who are complete racists and look at Hispanics as dirt, too.

Undocumented Democrats!

I like to think that it will be up to law enforcement. With a new Administration many of these problems will simply head south of the border. No need to compromise our principles when dealing with lawbreakers. Attrition thru enforcement. Those that refuse to leave on their own, when detained by law enforcement at some point, will be banned from permanent residency. Excellent motivation for illegal aliens to leave and sign up for work visas from their homelands.

Frank, you hit it right on the head. We need to give dignity and respect to those criminals who have overstayed their travel/education visas or who crossed the Mexican border into the US without permission. We should also thank them for enrolling in our schools causing overcrowded and the need for ESOL programs, using our hospitals, now going bankrupt, our healthcare and social services systems, also pushed to the limit. Lets not forget all the gang violence, rapes, prostitution, drugs, incarceration costs and other "benefits" for our communities. see www.theycometoamerica.com Frank we really need to stop the "bigotry and hate", and continue to welcome those who just lost their documents on their way here. Forget about those one million legal immigrants who come to the US every year the legal and right way. They just followed the rules, but who cares.

Brad, yeah Frankiegirl is right...that is IF you are a leftist, liberal, progressive, socialist, communist, Marxist and whatever other word they describel themselves on any given day. Frankiegirl, screw PC, no bigotry involved here. What you are spewing out is how you left wing nutjobs give criminals (listed below) the benefit of a doubt and that the victims (the MD taxpayers that are getting F***ed) need to prove their innocence. Oh and when I use the term "criminals" I mean whatever you want to call it, undocumented, illegal, (those who aide and abette) Ike Leggett, Martin OWEmalley, Chris Van Hollen, Cardin, Mikulski, the MoCo county council and so on...it is all the same...CRIMINALS...they have bronken the law. Last word Frankiegirl, because you lose AGAIN. Go play with your girlfriends, jag(off), Steveie, Fifa the foot fairy...

I'm confused. What is a "moral right to be in Maryland?"

@Rose...a moral and legal right...means you need to be a citizen or have the right documents...otherwise you are ILLEGAL and a CRIMINAL, since you have broken the US law. Maybe you did not get that memo? Look in your in-basket.

Frank, actually my immigrant grandparents did come with papers and permission. So does the one million legal immigrants a year that come to America. This compares to the lawbreakers, mostly Hispanic illegal immigrants who walk across the border or overstay their education/travel visa. There is a big difference and Maryland citizens know it. In-State Tuition for Illegal Aliens will be defeated in November! Papers do make a difference because these uneducated, illiterate lawbreakers would never be granted a green card.

That being said, I have no problem with illegals for the most part, they are willing to work 10 times harder than your average american, and god forbid you try and get a middle class teenager/20 something to work at all.

...huh?

I get it Legal...hahaha. Then you have those like jag(off) who just does not get it. Even if you spelled everything out with facts and figures...it (jag and his girlfriends) will NEVER get it. No matter how you look at it, undocumented or illegal it is against the law.

It's true. B Allen is way smarter than me. Just read his comments. Really the cream of the intellectual crop, obviously. Well, at least for a 12 year old. Quite impressive, how he recycles the same, mundane insults over and over again for, literally, thousands of posts. He's obviously an exceptionally important little boy whose life is really, really valuable.